What was so Revolutionary about Pinata Full of Bees

[seanisthegood]

I've always heard that Pinata Full of Bees was this revolutionary show.

In The Art of Chicago Improv : Short Cuts to Long-Form Improvisation
by Rob Kozlowski, he calls it "the show that changed everything"

What was it, why was it so important, does anyone have a tape?

[mullaney]

I think anyone who had seen a couple Second City reviews before Pinata would agree that Pinata changed a lot of things at Second City. Before that show, all the reviews followed a pretty clear formula. The show would open and close with a big musical number and the sketches in between would tend to fall into neat categories. You had to have at least a few blackouts (one joke short scenes). Every review seemed to have a sketch that took place at Wrigley Field. You would have two person scenes and some group scenes. You might have one or two runners which returned a couple of times through the show. Every scene was edited by a blackout on the stage and I think a musical interlude provided by the keyboard player. There wasn't ever a real theme to the show, they were always just a collection of the best scenes they could come up with. And the title was always a pun based off a famous play, book or song title, and usually had little if anything to do with the content of the show.

Pinata broke all of those rules. First off the scenes were interconnected, meaning a lot of characters and ideas not only came back, but entered each others second or third beats. There was no conventional opening and closing song. Most of the music was not from the keyboard but from clips from actual songs much like the sharp, hard musical bridges that most sketch shows use at the UCB. There were no blackouts. The players changed costumes and move chairs and props in full view of the audience. There was an overall theme to the show and the title was not a pun, but a reference to an actual monologue from the show. It was very consciously like a Harold and looked a lot like the first couple of sketch shows that the UCB put together. This was no accident, since one of the driving forces behind that show was Adam McKay, who had been in many of the early UCB shows and played with Besser and Ian in the Family, the long-running house team from ImprovOlympic. It was his first and last Second City review, since he became a writer for SNL in the middle of that run.

For me it was like night and day. Before Pinata, I really had little interest in Second City. Sometimes the reviews would have funny sketches or performances, but the format had always seemed very tired to me. Coming from a theatre background, I was always frustrated that they didn't do more to create a show with a cohesive feeling to it. It was just a collection of sketches. And there was no edge to be seen, the shows catered to a soft suburban and tourist mentality. They weren't challenging in any way--which is sad when you think of the roots in political satire that Second City had in it's early years.

Anyway, after that point, the shows in general were far more interesting than they had been. Mick Napier from the Annoyance directed 3 of the next 4 shows I think, and they were all very interesting. In each one they experimented with different things. He inserted some actual improv into the shows (not just the after show improv set). They put time into the sets, the design and the overall idea of each show. It was a huge change going to see a Second City review and not to be sure what was going to happen next.

Some of that old format started to creep back into subsequent reviews. I haven't seen one in 5 years, so I don't know what they are like anymore. But for a time at least, there was a real sense that you could try new things and that all the rules could be broken. I'd be interested to know if that has changed much.

It also should be noted that it broke one more rule. For many years, each cast of 6 players always included 2 and only 2 women. When Scott Glasier left the cast to write for Conan, he was replaced by Tina Fey, making the cast 3 and 3. She played all of his roles as written. I'm not sure if they stuck with that, but all the reviews I saw after that had a cast of 3 and 3.

[seanisthegood]

thanks

[Brian]

I thought "Pinata Full of Blees" was a great show for all the reasons Kevin described. It certainly had a huge impact, inside and outside of Second City. I'll always admire the cast of that show, too.

As influential as "Pinata" was, however, I wish that the 1990 Second City E.T.C. show "America Lite" got mentioned occasionally for its innovations as well. The entire second half of the show was a series of interconnected scenes relating to "the last liberal" on Earth. The whole show was great but that second act was groundbreaking in its structure. The cast included Michael McCarthy, Ron West, Ruthie Rudnick, Jill Talley, Ron West, and Mark Beltzman and the director was Nate Herman.

[Gwyn]

I was going to say, Brian, that E.T.C. had a lot of innovative shows.
In fact E.T.C. was created for the purpose of being edgier than Mainstage, which DID have to cater to mainly tourists and suburbanites.

I remember many of the shows I saw back there being WAY cool. I think maybe even the first time they integrated video was back there.

However, Pinata was like an overhaul of the whole form, it's true.

[MC Johnson]

"Pinata Full of Bees" was the first Second City Revue I ever saw and remains the best I can remember, though there was a terrific string of them for a while. I had just gotten into sketch comedy in college, so at the time it felt like going to Rome and bumping into the Pope on the street.

etc's "Holy War, Batman!" was awesome, and I hear great things about the current etc show, which I'll be seeing post-Turkey Day.

[Brian]

"Pinata" certainly deserves its reputation as a great and innovative show. I especially loved Adam McKay and Scott Adsit's scene "Gump" in which Scott played a highly successful but mentally challenged executive. I'll never forget the threat he made to Adam when presented with the disturbing IQ test results: "I could crush you, Jerry. Crush you like a cloud."

[goldfish boy]

However, Pinata was like an overhaul of the whole form, it's true.

"The Heliotrope Players' Production Of Thornton Wilder's 'Our Town'" was a pretty big departure, too, and it predated "Pinata" by at least a year. Didn't last long, though.

[Gwyn]

"The Heliotrope Players' Production Of Thornton Wilder's 'Our Town'" was a pretty big departure, too, and it predated "Pinata" by at least a year. Didn't last long, though.
Yes, that's one I was thinking of! I never remember names though.

I watched that one develop, as I was going to sets almost every Saturday at that point.
I thought it was hilarious.

The other one I was thinking of was the one with Rose Abdoo and Joe Liss as the Polatino couple with their own....cable show I think it was...and that had the video thing with....was it Zulevic? I might be melding two different shows here...

[Cooperweb]

I thought "Pinata Full of Blees" was a great show for all the reasons Kevin described. It certainly had a huge impact, inside and outside of Second City. I'll always admire the cast of that show, too.

As influential as "Pinata" was, however, I wish that the 1990 Second City E.T.C. show "America Lite" got mentioned occasionally for its innovations as well. The entire second half of the show was a series of interconnected scenes relating to "the last liberal" on Earth. The whole show was great but that second act was groundbreaking in its structure. The cast included Michael McCarthy, Ron West, Ruthie Rudnick, Jill Talley, Ron West, and Mark Beltzman and the director was Nate Herman.

I remember America Lite well. And I agree. Just thought I'd mentioned magical Ruby Streak as well who I believe wrote the closing 'show-stopping' number.

[Cooperweb]

I was going to say, Brian, that E.T.C. had a lot of innovative shows.
In fact E.T.C. was created for the purpose of being edgier than Mainstage, which DID have to cater to mainly tourists and suburbanites.

I remember many of the shows I saw back there being WAY cool. I think maybe even the first time they integrated video was back there.

However, Pinata was like an overhaul of the whole form, it's true.

Actually e.t.c was created to house non-second city acts at first. Likes of Judy Tenuta and a string of local talent, most non improv. But within a year or so it was contracted to Northwestern's Practical theater (Art is good) who did about 4 revues there. And from that cast Second City absorbed Rich Kind, Tom Virue, and Isabelle Hoffman but not before SNL snagged Gary Kroger, Paul Barron, Julie Louis-Dreyfus and Brad Hall.

The Second City National Touring company petitioned Bernie Salins to keep e.t.c within the family and that is when it became the "theater in the back." And from their first revue "Cows on Ice" it had proven itself edgy indeed, but a fact less planned and somewhat resented from the Main stage on Wells. But the quiet rivalry only spurred each other to better and more relevent material. All in all a great time to follow Improv in Chicago.

[Brian]

Cooperweb,

Thanks for all the info. I didn't know that people like Judy Tenuta did stuff back in the e.t.c. space. Did Emo Phillips perform back there, too?

I feel terrible for leaving out Ruby Streak when mentioning "America Lite". I have so much respect for Ruby. I was a clueless student back when I saw "America Lite", though, and didn't know nearly enough about Second City's musical directors at the time. She was the music director for "America Lite"? I didn't know that. Ruby has obviously made a huge contribution to every show she's ever been involved with.

[Gwyn]

Absolutely! Ruby was the best!
IS the best! Is she still working there? It's been so long since I've been back...

I was lucky enough to have worked with her on our Level 5 show! If you can believe that.
It was a great learning experience!

[Brian]

Gwyn,

Ruby was still working there last summer when I stopped by. It was great to see her, even for a few minutes. As far as I know, she's still the Musical Director for the Mainstage.

I never got to put up a show with her myself (that's cool that you did), but I've always liked talking with her.

[Gwyn]

Poor Ruby. Suffering us fools....
Yay for us! Boo for Ruby, I'm sure!

[El Jefe]

"Pinata" certainly deserves its reputation as a great and innovative show. I especially loved Adam McKay and Scott Adsit's scene "Gump" in which Scott played a highly successful but mentally challenged executive. I'll never forget the threat he made to Adam when presented with the disturbing IQ test results: "I could crush you, Jerry. Crush you like a cloud." That sketch is on the CD included with the Second City book, I think. I can't remember if there are other Piñata sketches on the CD.